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Persona fusion discussion
How is persona fusion in the game can be relate to real psychology?
Also this thread are meant for discussion so anyone can ask question here
To be blunt, it most likely doesn't. Fusion is more just taken from Persona's mother series, smt. Demon fusion is one of the main mechanics of smt so it'd be weird if it didn't exist in Persona.
yeah the fusion is more of a gameplay thing than a story thing. It might be better to look how the demons you fuse together relate to the final product, what arcana is being used, and so on. though if you really wanted to try, you could relate it to Jung's individuation process, of bringing everything, including your Persona, your shadow, your anima and animus, and any other archetypes you accumulate, into your Self to become a truer version of you
Can you re-explain second paragraph?I dont quite get it yeah the fusion is more of a gameplay thing than a story thing. It might be better to look how the demons you fuse together relate to the final product, what arcana is being used, and so on. though if you really wanted to try, you could relate it to Jung's individuation process, of bringing everything, including your Persona, your shadow, your anima and animus, and any other archetypes you accumulate, into your Self to become a truer version of you
(edited by Chie_chan)
Right. Pulls up Powerpoint presentation I made on this very subject for school So the Persona series is obviously based on the works of Carl Jung, Personas, Shadows, that kind of thing He defined the average person's life into two parts, two acts if you will: Ego-Differentiation: First half of a person's life. Revolves around the development of the Ego (aka the conscious mind, and the side that seeks purpose and identity), including awareness and education Individuation: Second half of life, reunification of the ego with the fuller self. The merging of the once separate Conscious, Personal Unconscious, and the Collective Unconscious - This will create the full "Integrated Self" through personal, subconscious trials [i.e facing your shadow, encountering and developing archtypes, developing your anima or animus, etc.] According to Jung: the Ultimate goal in life is to create a sense of selfhood Worth noting is that this path of life is what the Persona series uses the Tarot Arcana, since the Fool's Journey of the Tarot Cards is a perfect recreation of this process. Its why you unlock more powerful Personas when you complete a Confidant/Social Link I can send you my Powerpoint if that helps at all
So by fusing both personalities(First and Second life) it creates your 'better ' self? I dont know Sorry, its just Chie being Chie
(edited by Chie_chan)
Its not "both" personalities. It's important to remember that these are merely divisions of a person's life. Both [u]processes[/] (I want to emphasize the difference between process and the different aspects of your personality) are gradual, they take place over time. Like, I couldn't merge with my shadow and develop my Anima to the 4th stage in a single day. That's not how it works. This model is mainly to describe how to approach a person developing themselves. What I'm arguing for Persona is that you fuse your Personas together to make stronger ones, and you fuse those together to make stronger versions of those. At the end of everything, you should be able to take hold of the Ultimate Persona, which only appears (typically) after you obtain the World Arcana, the symbol of the end of the Self-Individuation process. You gradually build up and harmonize these different parts of yourselves to make the best version of yourself
Ok I get it now, thanks. next question is about the protagonists in Persona games. The ones that have the power of wielding more than one Persona. I wonder if that kind of people really exists, can it really happen in terms of jungian psychology or is it just another thing that the game needed?
The protagonist's arcana is The Fool. It's mostly numbered as 0. At first, The Fool (or Jester) is an innocent, inexperienced person that doesn't know what to do with his life. His perspective on life is still a raw one. The Fool can communicate with anyone because of his naivety, and earn experience. So, it has the capability to change to anything and that's why it's suitable for the protagonist. "The Fool Arcana does not mean that it can be taken lightly. The Fool is number zero. It is the void from which all other things begin."
Basically what Amami said. The Protagonist is both mechanically and narratively a blank slate protagonist, perfect for portraying the player, as many RPGs do. Persona 3 mentions that the protagonist is like the number 0, something completely void, but also has infinite possibilities. From a narrative perspective, this is showing how the people around you affects your worldview ("Who you are is heavily influenced by who you know"), from parents to friends and colleagues to superiors, etc. As the protagonist encounters each character who already has an identity, he adds parts of each person to himself until finally it culminates in full development.
Such people exists in real world?
Well I mean we're all influenced by other people (nature vs nurture I guess). The protagonist is just taking that to a logical extreme
What about the relationship between The Fool and The World? Both of them are numbered XXII sometimes. That mean The Wold is the baked version of The Fool? Persona protagonists do change from The Fool to The World, too.
No the World is always number XXI. It's just the Fool that is either 0 or XXII. You have to understand what is called "the Fool's Journey" but basically its a classical narrative structure as the empty fool encounters new trials and teachers as he/she ascends through the Tarot order. The XXII is the embodiment of the Fool AFTER the Fool's Journey, while the 0 is before
http://www.learntarot.com/journey.htm
I had an idea about The Fool's Journey but I didn't know that's why The Fool is XII sometimes. So there's nothing between The World and The Fool? Some info about The World would be good to know.
(edited by Rantaro_Amami)
Oh, and can you guys pls explain me about Palaces about how can one‘s desire can be related to Jungian psychology?
Well, palaces aren't specifically related to Jungian theory but shadows are. The whole persona series is pretty much persona vs shadow, which relates back to the theory, as both are parts of the human mind. The palaces and distorted hearts are just another setting for the persona series, as far as I know. So, taking this from https://www.biddytarot.com/tarot-card-meanings/major-arcana/world/: The World card shows a naked woman wrapped in a purple cloth, dancing inside a large laurel wreath. She looks behind her to the past, while her body moves forward to the future. In her hands are two wands or batons, like the one the Magician holds. It is a symbol that what was manifested with the Magician has now come to completion with the World. The wreath is circular, symbolising a continual cycle of successful completion and new beginnings because, as the woman steps through the wreath, she is completing one phase but beginning another one almost straight away. Around the wreath are four figures (a lion, bull, cherub and eagle), similar to those in the Wheel of Fortune. Both the World and the Wheel of Fortune speak to the cyclical nature of your life and your progression through its cycles. The four figures represent the four fixed signs of the Zodiac—Leo, Taurus, Aquarius, and Scorpio. They are symbolic of the four elements, the four suits of the Tarot, four compass points, four seasons, and the four corners of the Universe. They are here to guide you from one phase to the next, bringing balance and harmony to your journey. It's really long but basically, it's a complete form, and it represents completeness and success. The four animals represent cardinal points (like NESW, or four season, or four tarot suits, etc.).
Do you guys think the main character of Persona 6 is going to keep the Fool Arcana or not? I feel like it's suitable because the Fool is the main character of the Fool's Journey and each protagonist has their own journey that they go on to reach the World Ariana.
That won't be a persona game if not. Actually, it seems like Studio Zero's new game (Project RE Fantasy?) is based on The Fool's Journey, too. "A Fool's Journey"
@J-o-k-e-r, there's no doubt about it. All the protagonists thus far have been, and it's just the trait of the protagonist. It would be getting rid of a core part of the persona series.
Yeah its just a part of the series intergrally
What if the next protagonist is a kid in junior school? That would be great
Living a high-school life is a main part of the series, too.